How To Build Your Online Business Using Online Courses | Interview with Nathalie Lussier


Hi everyone, I’m really excited to
welcome our guest to the show today. She got a very interesting start actually
originally training as a software developer and getting her 10,000 hours
of software developer being offered a job with a big Wall Street firm and then
deciding that she saw some interesting opportunities in the econom
starting her own business originally as the raw foods which became
the real foods which at realfoodswitch.com and being very successful with that
and then starting to show other people how she’s built such a successful
business online and you can find out more about her at NATHALIELUSSIER.COM. We’ll put
the link in there and a few other places she’s got her 30 day list challenge
which is at 30DAYLISTBULDINGCHALLENGE.COM and Natalie
Lussier, welcome to the show really excited to have you here and excited to
talk about online education, future of it, and educational technology and even
some interesting things like gamification and pilots and launches
will see how much of that we can get into here today. Thanks for having me
Greg I’m excited to be here. Great so and I had to say that this is kind of funny we
were just chatting before we hit record here that you’ve just had a little baby
girl so that’s very exciting and congratulations. Thank you yeah and it’s
interesting because now that I’m like playing with her and I’m like okay how can I
add more play into what we do in our business so I feel like it’s somehow
going to all you know through back together. That’s excellent yeah and it’s
funny I’ve got as I mentioned I got a little girl at home who’s almost one now
and it’s, I know a lot of people sort of said like “Oh how are you gonna keep
doing business when you’ve got a kid is not gonna change things”. I found it’s
actually made things almost easier because I’m so focused now on basically
two things in my life: business and family and that’s pretty much it sort of like you,
find room for other things too but Yeah absolutely and it’s making me like
a lot more focused with when I say yes to and kind of what ends up on my
calendar so I’m actually traveling less not maybe doing less speaking gigs but I
feel like I can get more done both at home and in the business because of that.
That’s great. Well so wonderful congratulations and I
know a lot of us get into especially the building your own business thing so that
we can spend more time with family so it’s cool to see it when it actually
materializes. Totally it’s true. So you, we maybe won’t get too much into real
food switch but I thought that was fine just seeing a little pictures of you
riding on the carrot and that was your early starts. I had sort of the
similar beginning created my own online course and then got in moved on from
there but what I’m just curious sort of that moment of a software developer, Wall
Street firm, big job offer, parents saying, go for it, that’s your career and you
saying ” Now I’m gonna go do my own thing online”. What was the the big thing
that made you turn in that direction and give you the confidence to do it because I think
for a lot of us that’s the big thing is why should I turn this down and go for
the risky route. Yeah and it’s just totally true what you
said about my parents were like you just spent like five years and all this time
and energy towards this goal and now you’re just completely walking away from
it and especially my peers my friends who are also graduating like they were
going off to jobs that facebook and google and you know also on Wall Street
and it was kind of like “Wait you’re taking like a step back or what are you
doing exactly” but I had actually worked at the company as an intern so I
had you know hands-on experience with what kind of work I was going to be doing and
part of me kind of intuitively knew that if I said yes to this job I would
probably wake up you know 30 or 40 years down the line and be like “Wait where did
my life go ” and that’s really what motivated me and my dad was actually
like “Okay I kinda get it you know like he, he’s the hairdresser so he has his
own business too that he was like “You can start something why not” My mom was definitely kind of on the
opposite end of the spectrum and she was like “What no take the sticky job again” but then you know it and it definitely
took a while for my business to actually take off so there was some time where I
was kind of not confident and I had some doubts but then my husband today you
know we were dating at the time he was like “You know i’ll support you will
figure it out” and you know there were times where he didn’t also believe but
it was on early days he was totally like “go for it you know we’ll figure out what
you” and and now he works with me in the business so it’s definitely come full
circle. That’s awesome, that’s great he supported
you in the beginning and now that yeah I saw that he joined you that’s
great so he’s on the software development side too with ambitional
right? Exactly Yes. Great excellent.Wow that’s actually, I love
hearing that story of people just taking the plunge and going for it. I know
my background in life got lots of friends who are practicing law who occasionally
say “I’ve got this cool business idea, I don’t know should I take the jump” and so
it’s pretty cool to see what people actually do you take that jump and
then hopefully it works out. Great There’s always great, right? and for me
like I knew if I was going to start a business that was the time because I
didn’t have any dependents I didn’t you know I wasn’t a brand-new mom at the
time,right? I didn’t have a tough rent to pay, I actually moved back in with my parents
for a couple months and then that helps a lot because it took the pressure off
of having to figure out exactly how to make money right away but then you know
once I did actually move in with my boyfriend you know then I had to pay
rent and actually that motivated me to even figure out how to make money at
that time so it’s all kind of part of figuring things out stage I think. Yeah excellent.Great I wanted to chat a
little with you just quickly with you about sort of pilots and launches I’d
read on your site, one of your comments about launching is not a business model
but it can kick-start thing so I thought that was an interesting way of phrasing
it because you definitely see people out there sort of pitching launch launch
launch, I even see businesses that seem to be run entirely around a series of
launches with no sort of sustainable thing in between, what’s your just curious your thoughts
on that one. Yeah so I’ve seen people kind of start
businesses where the only thing they have to make money is doing a launch,
right? and they don’t open their course of their product throughout
the year maybe they open it once a year or twice
a year and what ends up happening is you’re kind of in this feast or famine
circle and you know what you’re doing a launch you know and money comes in but then in
between you know either if you have a team or you know you have to be yourself then, you
don’t have money coming in and that can be very stressful and you never quite
know how a lot just gonna go that’s one of the scariest things about doing
launches, if you’re waiting six months or a year for your next influx of cash
but it doesn’t go as planned, then you’re really incapable and your businesses you know
kind of shaky ground at that point so I much prefer to have both an evergreen
waited to kind of build your income and have sales happening on a daily basis
and if you do want to do launches, I you know fully support launches. I have a program
called Launch and Profit so I think it’s a great way to kick start a new course
or new offering or kind of reopen something with a lot of energy but it doesn’t have to be the only way that
you make money in your business. Right. Okay yeah that’s a good way to look at
it definitely I know with that, with my own course when I first launched, it was
to no fanfare. I had a blog and I just kind of put a link up to see if anyone
would care and we never this was over 10 years ago so I hadn’t even heard of you
know all of these launch concept so we got out there and it was very sort of
slow incremental growth but it’s ten years later and it’s still cranking it
out and I do nothing for it so it’s great but yeah it would have been
interesting to try the big launch approach with that originally but it was
all pretty much it wasn’t a thing on the web back then but it’s
interesting because you do look at people and I know you’ve been a guest
lecturer for Marie Forleo and you look at her and like her be school that’s a
once-a-year two-week kind of thing but I guess she’s just on such a different
scale for most of the rest of us that you don’t especially when you’re getting
started don’t want to compare yourself to her because she can certainly make
enough money and launch the last year and she has all sorts of other every
green stuff going on. So it’s a bit, I guess sometimes dangerously misleading
to just look at the best players into in the industry. Yeah exactly I like to say that you
don’t want to compare the outside of somebody else’s business to the inside
of your own business because you don’t quite know what’s going on under the
hood right so maybe she’s getting speaking gigs or doing other things that
you might not be seeing that is bringing income and she says a book and she
has kind of these other programs that she sells scrap the year and I see this
a lot especially with membership sites where people are like I’m gonna charge
ninety-nine a month and only have a hundred people on their email list and
you know not all of them are going to become numbers so it’s kind of a crazy
thing to do but you see you have a big list of a hundred thousand people are
200,000 people have a 99 other month membership program and for them it
scales because they have those numbers and it will think it’s the same for
launches or other things when you’re looking at the outside of a business
it’s like”Oh I’m going to do that too. It seems to be working for them like let’s
do it” and then you get there and you’re like ” Oh I don’t quite have the same exact
configuration in my business” so it doesn’t quite work that way. Yeah definitely yeah and I I’d rather
post of yours recently about you know launching businesses that aren’t
teaching other people how to launch businesses and you know you talked about
a bunch of different areas that people are being successful in and how
people who are say selling sewing courses or you know dance courses don’t
have that incentive to go and tell everyone in the world how successful
they are in fact you almost don’t want to because you found your need your
niche. So we hear all these great stories
of the success stories of people who are teaching business-to-business and how to do
business but you don’t hear as much about that the little one, the little
niches of of people teaching that sometimes are even more successful. Absolutely yeah and you know I have
friends who are you know teaching people about green smoothies or taro and
spirituality and they’re like killing it but you’re never gonna heard them talk
about their numbers because it doesn’t really make sense right and it’s not
going to motivate people to drink for free smoothies if you say. Anything
that might do the opposite like you know if it don’t want to see
you swimming in that kind of green so let’s, I saw with you have this
30 day list building challenge and for people interested in that that’s a
30DAYLISTCHALLENGE.COM and tell us a little bit about
that and then I know you we were talking a little bit about how to use free
courses to build your email list and sell organically, tell us a little bit
about your strategies around outside of things. Yeah so that was an idea that I had
about three years ago and it just kind of came out of the blue, I was my
business is doing well, I had basically a month where I didn’t have anything
planned, like no promotions, no launches, nothing and I was like “What could I be
doing?” and I was like “Oh building my list I know it’s always going to help my
business” and i was like “what if I had other people join me and shared what I
was doing to kind of build my list ” and I had so such a big response that people
were like “Yes we want to do a thing like we’re committed for the next month too”
and it kind of grew out of that and it became its own like online course. So now
we have a daily video every day for 30 days one single action items that people
can follow and there’s Facebook groups of people can share and get feedback on
the often ideas and all kinds of things like that to really get them going and
building their list.And what we realized is that because we had all these content
we want to put it inside the members area and we also had our free courses
alongside, our free course if people would log in and then they would say ” oh cool you
have all these other courses and you know I would like to sign up” so it kind
of created cross-selling opportunities that were very organic so it wasn’t me
saying, sending about bunch of emails saying like “Hey buyy this thing but it was Ben
just like discovering more things kind of like when you’re at the checkout line
at the grocery store you see kind of candy or magazines and before you check
out how it’s kind of a similar thing where you’re like “Hey that looks cool I
want to check it out” and actually led to some increase in sales but that was actually not something I
even anticipated. It kind of just happened up you know by happenstance of
having people log into a member’s area everyday or a few days and then I’m checking it
out and like looking around and ordering things. Great excellent so within that
period you know what was, could you share maybe one of their top things for
dsaactual list building like strategy that’s worked for and especially I’m
always interested in stuff that works for people who are kind of new to the
process or it’s not going to cost them money because we hear always about these you know run
Facebook Ads yeah etc etc but the the freeones, the organic ones for people
who are relatively new to it always very interesting. Yeah and that’s actually what i found in
back in the day Facebook ads we’re not super popular in 2012-2013 when I was
actually so a lot of the ideas are free ideas that you can implement. So if
you’re just getting started, it’s perfect So some of the oned that I always recommend are figuring out where your people are hanging out online and it’s a
blog or if it’s a group or if it’s forum that you can actually usually become a
guest or write a guest post or just become a leader in that group of that
community and that tends to be such a huge way to grow an audience and there’s
different ways you can do it so you know if it’s a facebook group you could do
kind of a i’ll answer anything you have questions about day or kind of you know
little thread or something we could even do facebook live these days which I
think is also kind of becoming more popular and easier to do with technology
but then definitely guest posting to be is kind of one of those standbys that is
always going to work because other people are reading stuff online they’re
going to be consuming content and you can link back to your website and get
people to go and opt-in to your list back pain excellent and do you have any I know
especially for people are kind of new at that and i love that approach of joining
the community becoming a leader any tips on sort of that transition from
i found the right community I’m just joining too i’m now a leader i’m posting
but you know ideally avoiding that the part
where your you come across as spammy and you just posting like you know sign up
for my list here yes so I actually have people you know
who took the 30-day challenge back in the day and they filled their list to
like 2,000 people and they never share their optical link they’ve only done it
by this month facebook that facebook groups by just being super valuable
answering questions and then people click over to their profile and they see
their little about section where you can link to your site and their list and
actually like outline exactly what they did you just kind of like wow this is
like I you know taking it to the whole next level because I sometimes will link
to my site and I feel like that’s way easier not to much but this percent
thinking of right now she’s done the whole thing without ever looking to her
website people might have direct messaged her and find out more or
they’ll just click on her profile so I think as long as you be extremely
helpful and its os easy for people to find you so if your name is easily
googleable or if you say like hey I have something that on my website you might
want to check out you don’t have to link to but if you know the rules don’t
allow that in certain groups or whatever, they can actually go and find you if
they’re really curious , if you’re being really genuinely helpful , then you know
usually the moderators love that because they like an active group that’s really
helpful. Excellent yeah I know even in our own
group I found people who are super helpful that it makes the world of
difference for them to, absolutely, great yeah , I fail on that easily googleable name with
the last name like Smith it’s a bit tough. Alright that’s true yeah say in that case
you can say like “hey my name is Greg Smith” but then also put this other words
like you know whether it passes for my middle name is Ryan so I mean I maybe
I’ll make up a new middle name like yeah I think I’ve seen some people do that I’ve
always wondered if like David Siteman Garland with his middle name is Siteman
because he’s all about you know the internet or if you just threw that in
there. That’s a good , I wished I ask him.. Yeah I have. Excellent , Okay so one other thing that you’d
mentioned that I’d love to chat about is gamification and maybe go from there
a little bit into kind of like where you see online education or EdTech going in
the future. I love the concept of gamification. I spend a bunch of time
studying it and sort of like increasing completion and engagement but
I love to hear your ideas on that gamification. Yeah so I was actually just
reading in the Waterloo Alumni kind of magazine all about gamification they
have like a whole Institute, I think it’s just called “The Game Institute at
Waterloo”. so they’re doing tons of research and they’re applying it to like outside
of Education like even changing people’s habits around health and exercise and
wellness and meeting all that stuff so that to me is like awesome and thanks to
the online stuff. Its still not quite, they still cool but I feel like we’re
changing lives but in a slightly different way. So to me, it’s really about getting
people excited about your content and really completing the things that they
want to complete. So for example in our members area, we have, its called the heart quarters program
so we give people hearts every month and they also can earn hearts by
participating by completing horses and quizzes and also by sharing content and
basically they can use their hearts to be more content more perks like any
critiques or you know unlocking other bonus stuff.So to me that kind of
motivates people to actually complete the stuff. I think a lot of times when
you sign up for course. You have great expectations and you know good
intentions but you know life takes over and especially because you know if
a kid or you know anything else can kind of derail you from your plans so to have
those emails and those reminders that say ” Hey you know you have this in your
account, take advantage of it” and that whole kind of credit system can really
motivate people. Yeah. They’re ideas that I love to play around. We have this
accountability side of things so you know if you’re doing course by yourself in your
living room or your you know your house, it’s good but if you have somebody else
doing it with you and ask questions are saying like “hey can you
finish this part, what you think that area” that can take things to the whole
next level and there’s ways to kind of gamify that too where you can you know
in our case we kind of give people hearts for helping each other out so it kind of
keeps them motivated and also connected with other people so it’s not as isolating
to be studying online. I actually see when I think about my kids when she
grows up I’m like is “She really gonna go to school” I don’t know because online
has so much to offer and you know yes I still want her to be social so I’m sure
there’ll be other ways to kind of bring that in but I I really feel like there’s
so much to learn in the online space and all these different companies are
creating great courses and people, individuals, everybody’s, pretty great
content so I just want to make sure that whatever we create actually gets
consumed,right? If you’re the course creator, you spend so much time creating
all this material and thinking about how to deliver it in the best way possible
so people can really implement and take action on it, so you want to make sure it
doesn’t just become like digital test on their computer. Yeah definitely key and even from
the business respective the more people who actually work through your course
and not finish it, I mean they actually get value out of it you feel
better about the fact that you sold it to them, that you know you won’t have a
refund requests or dissatisfied reviews or and the referral thing obviously
goes through the roof when people are actually finishing and getting value. I like the idea the buddy system so I’m curious about that is that an
online buddy or an offline buddy? Are you encouraging people to go find a friend
down the street and take the course or is it more the online buddy scenario?
It’s more on online buddy for right now but I like the idea of having the local buddy
too but yeah so its basically you pair up and you kind of say like “here are the
things I’m working on and then you check in every two weeks and make sure that
you’re making progress and then you can earn hearts every time that you complete
what you said you wouldn’t do and you keep somebody else accountable”. Excellent that’s great. That’s a great
system, yeah you’re right because the interpersonal side that the online
learning your right can definitely be a little isolating sometimes and
obviously we see you know industry-wide completion rates are can be low. We’ve done some cool things here to make
sure that they’re much higher but yeah it’s definitely one of the bigger
challenge and it challenges in the whole space so that’s a pretty cool
idea with the kind of accountability and the buddy system there. Yeah and you know other things that
I think all of us going back kind of to the school days of like earning badges
or stickers or things when you complete things, can really kind of motivate people
and it’s really just it’s the intrinsic motivation but we’re kind of
putting a name on it or making it visual so it when somebody completes a course
getting them a little badge or a little sticker that they can share on
social media saying like “hey I just finish this” It also helps you build word-of-mouth
like you said that kind of gets back to your website because they like “hey you
know this person just completed this course, I’m serious about that too” and
they can kind of have a really nice circle of fact. Excellent yeah definitely,
that kind of thing it gives you something to work towards and then
you’re proud of it, you can share it, you know I’ve seen that work pretty well for
sure. Excellent and so any thoughts on this is always kind of a fun
one and it’s sort of very you know ambiguous up in the air but your
thoughts on the far future, well maybe not that far, but future education EdTech
online learning or otherwise Yeah Oh man, it intersects I’ve seen a lot
of things and so one of the things that just kind of popped up when you said that,
I’ve seen people kind of taking courses or books or kind of information and
distilling it into really bite size like you know like let’s say it’s a very
popular business book but you don’t have to read it because your honor and so
somebody will have like a five-minutes audio highlight of life here the top
five points you need to know about this book so I kind of see like almost like
“checking down of content or kind of displaying information” and at least for
me I know my personality likes like. Forgive me I’m boil it down for me please so at least I think there’s some of the
markets heading to that direction and there’s kind of the other side it’s like, you
really need to know the full details, like learning how to program or
learning how to do something where you need to go deep and very like narrow on
a topic. So I think there’s kind of in my mind a little bit of a split between the
two like obviously there’s going to be something in the middle too but I feel it was the two, the two
ends and if you can really master one of the other based on what your audience is
really looking for, I think you can really go far and go like your
business. Great yeah that’s it. It’s an interesting
one the whole bite-sized thing because I thought, I’m like you I love to be
able to go and say okay I can take this business book and consume it in 20
minutes and get the gist of it and I know especially with business books at
fair number of them even the really good ones have a lot of fluff built around
it’s something that probably could be delivered in a 10-page paper but then
they’ve people want to make a book so they add stories and background a lot of it
can be useful but sometimes it’s not all necessary but at the same time it can be
a bit dangerous because you get this the distilled summary and maybe you’re
missing some of the big picture, implementation, and other things behind
it so it’s yeah that’s an interesting one for sure.
Definitely something that I think will will be a bit of a winner in terms of
distilling that information because you’re right, people like to be able to
get the gist of things very quickly. Yeah and I think it depends on like
the personality and the goals of the learner, right? I think that’s another
thing that’s interesting and I have a friend who’s an instructional designer
and she actually decides courses for corporations in academia and so for her
like the the whole purpose of the course is very different and usually it is to get
people to either be able to do something different or to implement something so
in that case like that the content is very different and the way she teaches
is very different too but I think it depends like sometimes you do want just
the highlights and just give it to me and then sometimes you do want to go
much deeper and really like take something on. Another book that I want to
share is actually called Making Learning Whole . I think did I, I dont know , if mention somewhere. No. I feel that is a great book because it really
teaches you how to teach. One of the concepts that I love in that book that I
think as more people come online to teach, is like how can we become better
teachers and on the first chapter talks all about teaching the entire like kind
of the whole game so if you’re teaching somebody how to play baseball, you would teach that, you basically start
playing right , you wouldn’t say like okay if this happens then you do this. If this happens then you do that because that’s so boring and
like no kid is gonna want to start you know learning all the rules instead of
playing so how can we actually build in some of the stuff that you’re teaching
into the course so that they can start doing it even if I details yet and then over time in the next module of
the course or however you do it then you can actually start to to kind of learn
the finer little quirks and rules and things that need to be taught. Great yeah, that’s a good way of
looking at it because you’re right especially when you don’t use the
baseball analogy and that’s start making learning whole? Yes. Okay I have to check
that one out, thats good. Excellent and then now I
think we have time for sort of one more question here that’s probably not a quick
question but it made a comment about validating your ideas throughout your
marketing process. So I’m curious how you go about doing that. Yeah and this came about because the
very first time that I launched in my ruffles business and my very first
course was a total flop like nobody showed up, nobody bought, it was just total crickets
and I see that happen to a lot of new business owners because they haven’t
quite figured out what people want to buy from them yet and what it is that
they’re really know after learning or figuring out in their lives so one
of the ways that I first validated my idea was to actually get on the phone and
talk to people which seems like well I want to do this online business, I don’t
really want to talk to people, I just want to you know, somehow
magically create something and not have to talk to people but in my opinion
actually asking people like “Hey what are the biggest things that you struggle
with and you know if you could have this problem solved what would that looked like? and actually
asking really tough questions and asking the question you know and you know why
do you want that, what’s underneath that, kind of going deeper and deeper, that you
know that kind of data is something that you can get from a survey or from doing
any kind of mass online stuff that you can get and you know also asking them
like is this something you would actually pay for and people will tell
you and a lot of times you know they’ll be nice and also liked ” Yeah I think so and then you have to ask
thst okay so are you ready to sign up and if they say no you know they’re just
being nice and you know really onto the right thing. So for my second launch when
I was in like my rock foods business, I figured out that the thing people really
having trouble with were cravings. So I created of course all about cravings and
that was my first very successful course and so I think it’s really important to
figure out like it’s not like this generic thing that people want but
usually it’s very specific things they need help with and that can make a huge
difference. That’s awesome, I mean there’s a
a lot of gold on what you just said there. So for people watching at
you know watch that one more time that was good stuff for sure. The you know focusing on
something specific for sure that’s the, I’ve seen that time and again be a big
winner as opposed to you know going out and saying I’m gonna teach you about
healthy eating is way too big of a topic but getting into something like cravings
or I saw you had it actually intrigued me I said you had something about like
healthy desserts and I was like “Yeah I, you know my wife and I are at home
and she’s like I feel like a treat you know we get a cookie or an ice cream or
something and I’m thinking if I, if we had the healthy option there so then
that’s like another sort of nische thing that I saw you doing that because I
think it’s great. And then I love the idea of picking up the phone, I’ve done
that and and definitely encourage people to do that especially if you’re starting
out, its , you’re right. It seems weird, it seems non scalable, it seems not
online, but those conversations can change everything about how you go about
doing business and it doesn’t have to be that many right like you could have 10
or 15 of those calls even and potentially now you’ve got ten people in
your course and you’ve got some real fundamental feedback on what you’re
doing I just make sure you’re not calling your aunt or your mom or
something right? Yes totally, it has to be your people that
you would actually want to highlight you know you have to take your course absolutely.
Yeah so actually curious and this maybe goes back to a bit of the list
building and joining groups and stuff but where do you if you’re literally
just starting out you got an idea you’re gonna go and launch your course on raw
foods or baseball or hula-hooping where do you go find those first 10 people to
call for that? Yeah I feel like there’s already a
community, probably for no matter what topic you can think of. So I would do
some google searches, find out you know popular blogs, find out if they have a
community that you can join, if there’s a forum or facebook group you can also
just search on facebook directly, there’s you know group discovered kind of
link they’ve search through and you’ll usually like once you get there, there’s like a
rabbit hole avenue you do you like to find like so many other things that you can
potentially you know get into so, I would say do a little bit of research
and once you’ve done that research, I’ve kind of we’re going about earlier you
know get known a little bit kind of a helpful, answer some questions and
from there you know once you’re not completely new to the group then you can say “Hey I’d love to jump on the phone with
you if you have even you can help you with a certain issue and I’d love to get
your feedback on something”. That people are usually like they want to help,right?
Even they’re busy sometimes they are like “Oh yeah sure I’d love to help you out with
something and you know, asking their advice is always nice, people love you
know being helpful in that way. Great yeah and I think that’s a key
point of joining the group and being a little bit helpful first so you don’t just
pop in on day one and day two your saying “Can I call you on the phone” Right. but it doesn’t take that
long you know if you helpful post and answering people’s questions and all of
a sudden you know a week later even you can be saying like “Hey do you mind if we
have a quick chat?” Yeah I think that’s a great
approach, thanks. Yeah you’re welcome. Excellent. Anything else you wanted to
share with everyone here? I would say you know if you have a course inside of you
and you’re like I don’t know like maybe I need to finish my course before I
launch it or you’ve been working on something for a long time and I always
like you know, going back to this whole idea of like having those early people
in and maybe doing data or first version of your course. It’s easier to get
feedback once you’ve created something and once you started know getting people
in the door and excited about it and you know asking about what they actually
want and then creating with what they’re asking for, then it is to sit by yourself and you’re
looking over your basement or wherever you are trying to finish an entire
course and release it so at least for me i would say atleast you know you maybe
have the first module of the first piece of content done and then you release it
but don’t try to complete the entire thing because if you don’t have a real
deadline with real people on the line reading for your course you’re probably get it done for at least I wont. Yeah yeah
and I find the confidence boosting of having some people sign up for that
initial thing and give you some feedback is great like when i did my first online
course, I wanted this huge epic course and I put out a tiny version of an
initially people bought it, they paid money, they loved it, they wrote me nice
emails, and all of a sudden what turned into something that was like “Oh I don’t
know what I’m gonna find time and how I’m gonna do this I like buckled down
and I had the whole thing done in a few weeks and launch a might big epic course
because I had students paying and give me good feedback” so that’s yeah that’s
definitely good advice for sure. Excellent. Thank you so much for all
of your advice. I think a lot of people in our audience will find that very useful and if
you want to learn a little bit more from Nathalie and NATHALIELUSSIER.COM will
put the link in with the video and also 30DayListBuildingChallenge and
that’s 30 with the numbers. So 30 list, 30 day list building challenge and will
throw that link in there as well. I think you know they really appreciate your
time that was wonderful. Thanks for having me Greg. This is so fun. Great. Thanks.

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